This transcript was automatically generated and might contain errors.

[0:15] Mike Abrams: Welcome to The Wrong Cat Died, the podcast breakdown of Catastrophe. I'm your host Mike Abrams, and today we have another amazing guest.

[0:20] Mike Abrams: Right now you can see him as Santiago in Moulin Rouge, which is celebrating their fifth year on Broadway. But he has worked as Celine Dion as a creative consultant and stylist, and he made his professional debut as Macavity in 2003 in Madrid in a production of Cats. So welcome, Pepe Muñoz, and thank you for joining me.

[0:39] Pepe Muñoz: Hello. I'm so happy, so excited.

[0:42] Mike Abrams: I love that you love Cats, and it's awesome to me that this is really the beginning of your performing career, and now you're making your major Broadway debut here recently. You've done Cats so many times, and I know you're passionate about it. So many languages. So we're going to go into all of them, and all the languages, and all your theories, and all your stories. But I want to know, what did you know about it before Madrid in 2003? Have you seen it?

[1:08] Pepe Muñoz: So I went to a school in middle school and high school where dance and theater was kind of part of the program, and the teacher had done a super tiny, small production of Cats with some people in the school. And for some reason, I watched the VHS on VHS, and I thought, what is this? The music, for some reason, taunted me. My brain could not comprehend what was this music. And then the Cats. Anyway, fast forward, 1998. We come to New York with school, and there were two options to see two musicals. A group went to see Beauty and the Beast, and another group, we went to see Cats.

[1:48] Mike Abrams: And you picked Cats.

[1:49] Pepe Muñoz: I picked Cats, and I can't even tell you what happened. I don't know what happened. I was sitting there, and they were just dancing. And I think it was Cassandra, but I don't know exactly, because I was so young in the naming of Cats. Somebody crawled over me on the seats, and I want to say it was Cassandra. It changed my life. It changed my life. For years, I said, I didn't say I want to be a dancer. I said, I want to be in Cats, period. And once I'm in Cats, I don't need to do any other show. So that was it. That was it.

[2:20] Mike Abrams: So you saw Broadway, 1998. Did you see the VHS before that or after that?

[2:26] Pepe Muñoz: After. So I saw it here in New York, and I had the little... You know the pamphlets used to be those little triptychs for the shows? I don't think they have them anymore, but...

[2:36] Mike Abrams: No.

[2:37] Pepe Muñoz: I think I have one from, I don't know how many years ago, but I've collected a couple.

[2:41] Mike Abrams: Yeah.

[2:42] Pepe Muñoz: So I have that one from 1998. And before then, there was no Google. There was no YouTube. There was no nothing. I just had that little triptych, and I remember looking at it every single day. No, I was obsessed. You can ask my brother. You can ask my family. I was so annoying. I was just obsessed with this. And now, when I see people that come to Moulin Rouge over and over and over, I somehow can relate a little bit, because I go, I would have come to see Cats every day.

[3:15] Mike Abrams: How did you decide that over Beauty and the Beast? Like, that's a well-known movie and everything, and it's like, ah, let's take the different one.

[3:23] Pepe Muñoz: I guess because I had seen that little school production that my teacher had put up. I said, oh, let me see what the original is. And I think it changed my life. I don't know who was in the cast, because I don't have the playbill. I only have the little triptych. So I don't know who I saw perform that day. But I would literally try to find them on Instagram and send them a message saying, you changed my life. You made me a performer.

[3:50] Mike Abrams: There is a way to find, not exactly, but if you know around the date that you were there.

[3:57] Pepe Muñoz: Oh, April 14th.

[3:58] Mike Abrams: April 14th, 1999.

[3:59] Pepe Muñoz: Oh, you know, you got the date.

[4:02] Mike Abrams: Yeah, okay. After, I'm going to send you how you can find at least who was supposed to be there, unless you had any swings or understudies. But at least the cast that time.

[4:12] Pepe Muñoz: Oh, my gosh. It's there. It's online.

[4:14] Mike Abrams: Oh, wow. It's very well documented.

[4:16] Pepe Muñoz: I hadn't even thought about it. It was just, for me, it's this magical experience that happened to me. And yeah, I became a dancer. I only went to dance school, and I started going to dance school when I was 17. I only wanted to dance because I wanted to do the Jellicle Ball. I didn't care about any other dance. I didn't care about any other musicals. The only thing I wanted to be was a Jellicle Cat. This is it.

[4:41] Mike Abrams: And did you know which cat right away, or was it just any cat?

[4:44] Pepe Muñoz: I wanted to be Mistoffelees for the life of me. But then I realized that I'm 6'2", and I'm too tall, and I could never be Mistoffelees. And my brother, poor little brother, he was forced to watch that VHS over and over, because that was the only thing I would allow to watch. I was like, we're watching cats, period. That's it. And my brother was always obsessed with the Gruntum Tucker. And I was like, no, Mistoffelees is the dancer. You have to dance.

[5:13] Pepe Muñoz: I did a summer program in London at the Royal Ballet. And you're going to laugh at this. But I used to have very thick socks that I would cut off the ends and put them in my arms as leg warmers, like the Jellicles.

[5:26] Mike Abrams: Yeah, like the cats, yeah.

[5:28] Pepe Muñoz: Yeah. And there's this day at the Royal Ballet School, the teacher asked me in front of everybody to take them off. And I said, I can't. And she said, what do you mean? I said, I'm a Jellicle. I said, I can't take them off. I'm like, what? Like, I'm a Jellicle Cat. I can't do this. Anyway.

[5:45] Mike Abrams: That is amazing. I love that you just said the teacher's like, no, I'm Jellicle. That's it. I'm a Jellicle.

[5:50] Pepe Muñoz: Yeah, there's no questions.

[5:52] Mike Abrams: Yeah. You are. You've done it. What is it? Five, six, seven, eight, six times.

[5:57] Pepe Muñoz: Okay. In English, in German, and in Spanish.

[6:01] Mike Abrams: English, German, Spanish. So I want to hear the story about how you got found to be in this Madrid production.

[6:07] Pepe Muñoz: So that year that I kept my socks on my arms as leg warmers, I did another summer intensive. That was July in London. And in August, I was in Madrid with the Cuban National Ballet. They were doing another summer intensive. And on the Saturday, Sunday, Sunday, we were off. And on a Saturday, we went to see Phantom that was playing in Madrid at the time. And it was the replica version, the one from London with the entire creative team, with Jillian Lin's associates coming to take care of the show and everything. And it was a bunch of us dancers. And we put a hat on the floor on the Gran Via, which is, they call it the little Broadway. All the theaters are there, all the movie theaters. We put a hat on the floor, and we were dancing just to make some money while we waited to watch the show.

[7:06] Pepe Muñoz: And Marina Stevenson, who was a white cat in the closing cast of The West End, and Maura Chapman, who was the resident director of Phantom, were going to work. They were walking into the theater. Marina was the swing desk captain of Phantom. Moira was the director. And suddenly, they see these 20 or something kids, you know, lifting and doing fouettés and dance. And they said, they asked, they said, who are you guys? And we said, oh, we're doing the Cuba Bali summer thing. We're dancers. They go, do you guys sing? And I said, yeah, I'll sing. And they said, we're looking for people for cats.

[7:33] Pepe Muñoz: In my brain, I can't tell you, my brain exploded. I said, wait, what? Cats in Spain? They're like, yeah, we're doing the Spanish production, and we're finding it hard to find people. I said, okay, when's the audition? When's the cat? Sign me up. Sign me up. And I went to the audition, and I got the job. And it changed my life.

[7:55] Mike Abrams: Wow. So were you doing ballet on the show? Like, what type of dance were you doing?

[7:58] Pepe Muñoz: Yes. We were lifting the girls. We were doing all these big lifts. We were doing turns. We were jumping. I was 19. No injuries, you know, fresh teenagers being silly. I got hired as Macavity on the study Monkestrup and Rum Tum Tugger at 19.

[8:16] Mike Abrams: Wow. And so they sent you out to Madrid, and then this is in Spanish.

[8:20] Pepe Muñoz: This was in Spanish. It was the Spanish production. They had done Mexico and Argentina before, but they did a very specific translation for Spain because, as you know, the Spanish in every country is a little different. So, yeah. And I was so young, and there were veterans of musical theater in Spain working with me, and I was working with them. And I just learned so much.

[8:44] Mike Abrams: And this is first professional job.

[8:46] Pepe Muñoz: Yeah. And were you wearing your jellicle armbands when you were dancing outside of Phantom, or no?

[8:52] Pepe Muñoz: No, no. No, I wasn't. But can you imagine what I felt the first day of rehearsal? They came with Ziploc bags with our tail, our capizio shoes, and leg warmers. No, I said, wait, wait, wait. For years, I've been manifesting this and wanting this to be my life. And here I am with my tail. This is Pepe Muñoz Macavity. What?

[9:18] Mike Abrams: Yeah. So take me to the rehearsal process, because as someone who'd probably worn out a VHS version of it and seen it in Broadway, was there aha moments of the story? Because it's such a hard thing to comprehend. As a dancer, you're obviously following it. You want to do the jellicle ball. But from a storytelling perspective, did you kind of sit there and go, wow, I never would have thought about this? What was that experience?

[9:41] Pepe Muñoz: Yes. And I actually used some of that information that I was giving to try to convince people that Cats is more than just a dance show. Totally. Right? Because when people and this can connect with the jellicle ball that I saw this summer in New York City, which I go, oh, wow, wait, they've taken this and made it even better. How is that even possible? And it's because they took that little bit of information that is given to us. And it's a story about forgiveness and redemption and having a space for everybody. And they took it and ran with it and made it even better. I do remember Chrissy Cartwright, who was Ginny Lin's right hand. She got hired, I think, the show in London opened in 1981.

And she got hired in 1984 to be the resident choreographer. And she stayed there until it closed. So to be hired by Chrissy in Europe is a big deal. Because now that I've done it a few times, now you know what Chrissy wants. So when you go to the first day of rehearsal of each production, now I can tell you who's playing what. Just by standing in that room.

[10:47] Pepe Muñoz: Just by looking. Yeah. The girl with the biggest eyes is going to be Celebub. The tiny little one is going to be Rumpleteazer. I know it's Cassandra. It's so interesting because the typecasting is insane. But what was your question? Oh, well, she told us in rehearsals. Yeah, I just remember loving the little story about Grizabella and how Gumby was probably the same age as Grizabella, but Gumby decided to work in the house. And how, mechanically, I realized that Plato, Admetus, has a white spot on the wig, and so does Electra. So in my head, Admetus, or Plato, and Electra are siblings. And Gumby is our mom because she also has a white spot here. So it's just all these little backstories that we were told.

And the three words that I don't remember what they were for me, but Trevor Nunn created this list of the three words for each cat. And I do remember Chrissy telling me, Pepe, you're not a kitten. Don't behave like a kitten. But I was 19, so I wanted to be always on the floor with Puncible and Electra. And Pepe, no, you're an adult. You're Admetus.

[12:06] Mike Abrams: So you had to play kind of the villain, too, a little bit.

[12:08] Pepe Muñoz: Yes, and I don't want to be the villain.

[12:10] Mike Abrams: So I love this. So this is the professional debut, and then you've got a couple years, and then it was Germany next?

[12:19] Pepe Muñoz: Yes. So I did it in Madrid. Unfortunately, the production in Madrid wasn't a big success for ABC reasons. Cats didn't connect with the Spanish audience. And I can also tell you it's because Mamma Mia was down the street. Fuck You was down the street. So it was more of people wanted more like celebratory musicals with music that they knew, and Cats felt a little odd for them.

[12:45] Mike Abrams: So it didn't work.

[12:46] Pepe Muñoz: I mean, you picked it over Beauty and the Beast. So there's still a market.

[12:51] Mike Abrams: There's still a market.

[12:52] Pepe Muñoz: For me, it's perfection. If there was a production right now, I would go see it. I adore it. I adore it. And when we were about to finish, a friend that I made at the Royal Ballet Summer course, who I became really good friends with, and now he's a musical theater director. He did King Kong here in New York. His name is Drew McHoney. He got hired for the German production. And I remember sending him an email going, Hello, Drew. This is Pepe. I hope you're well. I just wanted to tell you I got Cats in Madrid. Ha ha. Remember when I kept my socks on, blah, blah, blah. And he sent me an email back going, Oh, my goodness. You're not going to believe this. I'm joining the German company. I said, Wow, what are the odds? Look at the ball as being Jellicles. And one day he sent me another email saying, Hey, Pepe, I don't know what you're doing, but the German production that was in Dusseldorf is going on tour. Are you interested? I said, Drew, the timing is perfect.

[13:49] Pepe Muñoz: Spain is closing, so I'm gonna go. I went to the audition, hired a German teacher to teach me the songs they sent me in music. So I learned the songs in German, and Chrissy was at the audition. And I showed up and she said, oh, I said, well, we're closing in a few weeks in Madrid, and I heard you're looking for people here. So they hired me as a swing. So I covered Alonso, McAvity, Tugger and Monkestrump in German. And that was one of the most beautiful years of my life. We went to Leipzig, to Dresden, to Switzerland, to Bremen, to Cologne. It was amazing. In German. So I made friends all over Europe. I learned a new language. And I was still doing Cats. No, I was the happiest, the happiest. But after that, I realized that I had done two and a half years in the professional world, and I had never been a human.

[14:50] Pepe Muñoz: Just crawling around at all times. Just crawling around. And I realized, I said, wait, wait, Pepe, this is weird, because I was going to turn 21. I joined at 19, two years later. I said, you know what, it would be nice to do a different show. And in Germany, I don't know if you know this, but Germany and the Netherlands, they do musicals in every city, three or four. All the productions go there. All of them go there. And they were doing Dirty Dancing, the European premiere. And I said, you know what, let's just try to do something different. So that's the only reason why I stopped doing Cats, because I wanted to do something else.

[15:25] Pepe Muñoz: Just be a human, do a different lift. Yeah, be a human for a minute. But I missed it, because in Cats, you feel so realized. You feel so like a dancer, because you're dancing nonstop. The whole show. Basically. Yeah, you get no breaks. Okay, so I'm curious a little bit, as someone like, I don't speak any other languages well enough to say I speak them, to learn a show that you watched all in English growing up, like you became obsessed with it in English, then you do it first in Spanish, and then you learn it in German. What is that like? I mean, because these names are all kind of mixed. They don't make sense to begin with, like adding a different language.

[16:09] Pepe Muñoz: Yeah, I think if I had to do that right now, it would be a nightmare. But I was super young. And like I say, the love for this piece, the love that I feel for the show and these characters and these people that performed for me and changed my life, the love that I have for this is so big that I didn't mind. They gave us CDs with the entire show with a phonetics teacher speaking the show very slowly. And we had phonetic class. We had a phonetic teacher that came with us, because there were British people, Italians, some Americans too. So not so many Germans in the company. And we have class.

[16:48] Pepe Muñoz: So I have vinyls for Spanish, Japanese, German, a couple of them. And I listen to them all. And I think Japanese and German are the two that I feel like the hardest to just kind of translate, because it just doesn't... I mean, it works amazing. It's still fun to listen to. It is. But it's different than what I'm used to and what I'm just... Of course. ...using in English so much. And so it's kind of one of those things that as not a native speaker of that language to do it on top of being at the right place at the right time, doing the right dance moment at the right time, as a swing, trying not to kick the right person, to change tracks and roles. It's kind of so difficult.

[17:30] Pepe Muñoz: It was difficult, but I guess because I knew... If I didn't know Cats that well and I got hired to do it in Germany, it would have been an uphill road for me, because I wouldn't know the show. But I think because I knew it A to C, upside down, inside out, the fact that I had to sing it in another language was not a big deal. I thought, no big deal. I'll learn German. And look at me now.

[17:53] Pepe Muñoz: You still know it. I speak basic German, you know?

[17:55] Mike Abrams: Yeah.

[17:56] Pepe Muñoz: So yeah, it wasn't difficult. Do you know if the vinyl that you have is Hamburg or Vienna?

[18:02] Pepe Muñoz: I think the one I have that I got most recent was Vienna.

[18:05] Mike Abrams: Okay.

[18:06] Pepe Muñoz: But I'll have to look and see. I slowly collect them. And then I have another former guest who has some bootleg collections on MP3s that he gets his hands on. And so I have a very wide range that I'm hoping to... It's fun to listen to it, because so much of it is the same, but different. And there's also some nuances. There's a different Mungojerry and Rumpelteaser that the 2019 movie used. So there are some other variations, and it's fun to hear, like, oh, that's the same, but also tweaked, or that's very different than...

[18:42] Mike Abrams: I learned the show in 2016. I had never seen it before that.

[18:45] Pepe Muñoz: And what happened in 2016? Do you just fall in love with it?

[18:47] Mike Abrams: I moved to New York, and I saw it, and I walked out as someone who is not a singer or a dancer, but who liked writing. I walked out going, I want to understand the plot. This is so loose, but there's also so much that I kind of was like, I really think there's a lot going on here. And it was kind of fascinating. And then, obviously, the thesis of my story is I don't think Grizabella was the right choice. So that was what kind of started this.

[19:14] Pepe Muñoz: Okay. Okay.

[19:15] Mike Abrams: So I saw it, and I made some jokes about that. But you know about the book, right? You know TSL, it's a poem.

[19:20] Pepe Muñoz: Oh, yeah. Now I'm five and a half, almost six years of this podcast. So I went from knowing zero. I'd seen it once in 2016, to now knowing which cats are considered siblings, and the storylines, and what's true, and names of parts of the Jellicle Ball, like of Copeland, and all these things. Things I should not know. And Copeland, because it sounds like a TV show that was called Copeland. And Princess Louise, there's another moment in the Jellicle Ball called Princess Louise, and it's because Gillian Lane, she says that on the DVD. She was in a cab late for rehearsal, and she was working with her feet in the cab. And when she looked over, there was a pub called the Princess Louise Pub. And so she calls it the Princess Louise. And hovers, it's because you're hovering over, whatever. It's just, I just love this show so much. I love it.

[20:12] Pepe Muñoz: So then let's just go through some of the other ones. You did a UK Italian tour?

[20:17] Mike Abrams: Yes. So right after, so I did Dirty Dancing. I did Spain, Germany, and Dirty Dancing in Germany. And then I joined Cirque in Vegas. After Cirque in Vegas, I was there for a year and a half. It was very intense. I said, I'm going to go back to Europe. And as I land in Europe, my friend, Joma Shane, who was Rumple Teaser in the UK, goes, because Cats becomes a database of people. It is such a hard show to do and to cast. Once you're in the world, you're in a pool of people that they just call. And she goes, Pepe, we're doing two months in Italy. It's the UK tour. It's in English. And we need a swing. Can I tell Chrissy that you're available? I said, absolutely. I'll go. So I went to London, rehearsed. And it was the first time I did it in English.

[21:05] Pepe Muñoz: Yeah. And I mean, that was great.

[21:07] Mike Abrams: And again, crazy, because it's what you grew up learning.

[21:10] Pepe Muñoz: Exactly. So the first day of rehearsals, to be singing it in English was pretty special to me. It was wonderful. And then also, it was during the summer. It was June and July in Italy. I was a swing. I did two shows. I didn't care. I was in Italy for free. That's amazing. And I didn't care, because at that point, the need to do the show was out of my system. I had done it for years. Now, it was just great to be part of another Cats company, make new friends, and say things like, oh, which one do you do? Oh, did you do it with blah, blah, blah? Oh, Germany. Oh, did you do it with... And that is always wonderful about the Jellicles.

[21:49] Pepe Muñoz: And there is when I started saying this stupid thing that I did it. And there's a picture of me where I wrote it with makeup on my chest. It's called Jellicles Forever. And people in international tours still say it. So I'm sorry, but I'm going to take credit for that. I started saying it because I said, wow, this can be the gift that keeps on giving. Jellicles Forever. I'm going to be a Jellicle forever. And I am.

[22:13] Mike Abrams: It does feel like a family. It feels like once you've done any production or anything that you are part of that Jellicle family and have a connection point. And it's 40-plus years of people doing it all over the world. And so that's really cool. So you did that. And then there was a... I'm trying to go through. There was Germany, a UK-Germany tour? Or is that the same tour?

[22:34] Pepe Muñoz: No. So that was the UK-Italy. And that closed. That summer, it closed. And the UK tour with David Ian Productions was closed. That winter, I got another email saying, hey, we are doing a UK-Germany. So it's going to be in English, but we're going to go to Germany for the entire winter. It was like three or four months, I think. And they said, but we don't have a Rum Tum Tugger. And we know you've understudied it always.

[23:00] Pepe Muñoz: Oh, wow. Could this be my chance to be the Rum Tum Tugger? So I got it. And I did the Rum Tum Tugger. It played on my behalf that it was in English, but we were playing it in Germany. Because, you know, everybody speaks perfect English when they do Cats. And because we were going to Germany, they said, okay, we can leave Pepper to have his Spanish accent. And plus, we're animals. It doesn't really matter.

[23:24] Mike Abrams: It doesn't matter. Exactly.

[23:25] Pepe Muñoz: We're not doing Shakespeare either.

[23:27] Mike Abrams: For sure. So did you call your brother or like, hey, I took your role?

[23:31] Pepe Muñoz: My brother came to visit and he said to me, to know that the one up there was my brother after you forced me to watch the VHS for years. He said it was kind of like the metaverse. You know, he was like, what? What is happening? It was wonderful. And we did, I don't remember the cities, but we finished in Frankfurt. And it was beautiful because it was the Frankfurt Opera House. And it was a huge production. It was just great. And that was, what, number four?

[24:01] Pepe Muñoz: That was four in 2008, I believe. Yes, that was 2008. And then there's a little break.

[24:06] Mike Abrams: There's a little break. And then fast forward to 2011, no, 2012.

[24:12] Pepe Muñoz: I came to New York and I auditioned for a West Side Story international tour and I got the job. But this was in January and the job started in May. So I said, fine, I'm going to Malaga, my hometown. I'm going to have a few months off. And I remember I used to be a smoker and I was having a cigarette on my parents' home in the sun, chilling. It was February. And somebody called me and said, my friend Dane said, hey, where are you? I said, I'm in Malaga. And they said, we're doing Cats in German. And of course, in German, there's less people that know the German version. And it was a tent. It was a European tour that was in a tent, a black tent. And they were in Vienna and everybody was injured. Everyone and their mother was injured. The opening, there was no Cats. And they said, can you fly tomorrow? I said, I can fly tonight. Fly me now.

[25:06] Pepe Muñoz: I said, the only condition is that I have to be done by the end of April, beginning of May, because I'm starting West Side Story. They're like, absolutely, just come and help. And originally, I was just supposed to be there for three weeks. Then it became four. Then it became six. Then I stayed for two and a half months. And it was phenomenal. I went from minus degree weather, where the tent was covered in snow outside, to being so hot in April that we needed kiddie pools outside. It was so hot because it was a black tent. So when the sun was shining, it was boiling.

[25:40] Mike Abrams: Yeah, not a lot of air conditioning in a black tent, too.

[25:44] Pepe Muñoz: So you did pretty much the same swing track that you did the first time, right?

[25:49] Pepe Muñoz: Exactly. The only difference was that the German production I did in 2005 was in a traditional stage format. And this one was very, very close to the original West End, where you had the stage and all the junk. And then there was a big circle that went down. So the audience was almost in a full circle.

[26:12] Mike Abrams: Yeah.

[26:12] Pepe Muñoz: So all the dances happened in that circle, facing out. So it was...

[26:17] Mike Abrams: Oh, okay.

[26:19] Pepe Muñoz: Yeah. So some tweaking of the staging.

[26:21] Mike Abrams: Tweaking of the staging.

[26:21] Pepe Muñoz: At that point.

[26:22] Mike Abrams: But it was fun. Oh, I had no problem. And they were so desperate. That played on my behalf. Because even if I was in the wrong spot, I was thinking, I wasn't saving your asses.

[26:31] Pepe Muñoz: So...

[26:31] Mike Abrams: Yeah. They're still running the show because of you.

[26:34] Pepe Muñoz: Don't give me notes. I'm helping everybody here. And that was great. That was great. Oh, my goodness. And then you had another break.

[26:41] Mike Abrams: Yeah.

[26:43] Pepe Muñoz: Before the final one. Or I don't want to say final. I feel like there's still...

[26:47] Mike Abrams: Let's call it the next one because...

[26:48] Pepe Muñoz: The next one. Because there's still, I think, you're a Jellicle forever.

[26:53] Mike Abrams: I sure am.

[26:54] Pepe Muñoz: That means there's still moments. And you've got, as you get through your career, I still... Someone said this a long time ago, but this is a show that you can play throughout your whole career because you can play different parts. You can play a kitten in the beginning, then you can play the kind of teens, and then you can play older, and then you end up at Gus.

[27:10] Mike Abrams: Exactly. Exactly. Or Deuteronomy, if you have the voice, you know.

[27:16] Pepe Muñoz: Yeah. I completely agree. I think as a dancer, as my cavity at 40, I would say no. And I don't think anybody would want to hire me as my cavity at 40 because it's hard. But if they wanted to play the Rum Tum Tugger again, I would. Because it's fun. It's just great. His dance track is not that hard. So...

[27:37] Pepe Muñoz: I think it was a very special experience for me because I started my career in Madrid, and I was Admetus in the first production of CATS in Spanish. It was a huge deal for me, and I remember the first time I put on the makeup and the costume. It was like stepping into a different world, and I felt like I was part of something magical.

[28:07] Pepe Muñoz: Performing in three different languages was a challenge, but it also opened up so many doors for me. I learned a lot about the nuances of each language and how to convey the emotions of the characters differently depending on the culture and the audience.

[28:37] Pepe Muñoz: One of my favorite memories was performing in Japan. The audience was so enthusiastic, and they really embraced the show. It was incredible to see how CATS transcended language barriers and connected with people from different backgrounds.

[29:07] Pepe Muñoz: I also had the opportunity to work with some amazing people in the cast. Each production had its own unique vibe, and I loved collaborating with different artists. It was like being part of a family, and we all shared a passion for the show.

[29:37] Pepe Muñoz: The choreography was another highlight for me. Each production had its own interpretation, and I enjoyed exploring the different styles. It kept the experience fresh and exciting, even though I was performing the same show.

[30:07] Pepe Muñoz: I remember one night in Madrid, we had a technical issue during the show. The lights went out, and we had to improvise. It was a bit chaotic, but we all rallied together and made it work. The audience loved it, and it turned into one of those unforgettable moments.

[30:37] Pepe Muñoz: Now, being in Moulin Rouge on Broadway, I feel like I’ve come full circle. The energy of the show is electric, and I love being part of such a vibrant production. It’s a different kind of magic, but it still feels connected to my roots in CATS.

[31:07] Pepe Muñoz: I think the themes of love and acceptance in both shows resonate with audiences. They remind us of the importance of community and finding our place in the world, which is something I’ve always cherished about being a performer.

[31:37] Pepe Muñoz: I also love how both shows allow for so much creativity. Whether it’s the costumes, the music, or the choreography, there’s always room for interpretation and personal expression. That’s what keeps the art form alive and exciting.

[32:07] Pepe Muñoz: I’ve had the chance to meet so many incredible fans along the way. Their passion for the show is inspiring, and it reminds me of why I fell in love with theater in the first place. It’s a beautiful community, and I’m grateful to be a part of it.

[32:37] Pepe Muñoz: I think it’s important to keep the spirit of CATS alive, even as we move on to new projects. The Jellicle Cats have a special place in my heart, and I’ll always carry that experience with me.

[32:47] Pepe Muñoz: Jellicles forever! I’m going to be a Jellicle forever.

[32:57] Pepe Muñoz: It’s a testament to the impact that CATS has had on my life and career. I’m excited to see where this journey takes me next.

[33:07] Pepe Muñoz: And speaking of journeys, I’d love to cast the characters from Moulin Rouge as Jellicle Cats. It’s a fun exercise to think about how those personalities would fit into the CATS universe.

[33:17] Pepe Muñoz: For example, I think Christian would be a perfect Rum Tum Tugger. He’s charismatic and full of energy, just like that character.

[33:27] Pepe Muñoz: Satine could definitely be Grizabella. She has that tragic backstory and a longing for acceptance, which aligns with Grizabella’s journey.

[33:37] Pepe Muñoz: And then you have Toulouse, who would be a mischievous Mungojerrie. He’s playful and artistic, always getting into trouble.

[33:47] Pepe Muñoz: It’s fun to think about how these characters would interact with the Jellicle Cats and what kind of stories they would tell.

[33:57] Pepe Muñoz: I think that’s the beauty of theater. It allows us to explore different narratives and connect with audiences in unique ways.

[34:07] Pepe Muñoz: I’m grateful for the experiences I’ve had and the people I’ve met along the way. Each production has shaped me as an artist and as a person.

[34:17] Pepe Muñoz: I look forward to continuing this journey and sharing my love for theater with others. It truly is a gift that keeps on giving.

[34:27] Pepe Muñoz: Thank you for having me on the show. It’s been a pleasure to share my story and talk about the magic of CATS and Moulin Rouge.

[34:37] Pepe Muñoz: I hope to inspire others to pursue their passions and embrace the beauty of storytelling through performance.

[34:47] Pepe Muñoz: Jellicles forever!

[41:26] Mike Abrams: Welcome back to The Wrong Cat Died. Today, I am thrilled to have Pepe Muñoz with me. Pepe has an incredible history with CATS, starting as Admetus in Madrid back in 2003, and now he’s currently performing as Santiago in Moulin Rouge on Broadway. Pepe, thank you for joining me today!

[42:56] Pepe Muñoz: Thank you for having me, Mike! It’s a pleasure to be here and talk about my journey with CATS and beyond.

[43:26] Mike Abrams: So, let’s dive right in. You’ve performed in six different productions of CATS. How did you first get involved with the show?

[43:56] Pepe Muñoz: I was cast as Admetus in Madrid, and it was a life-changing experience for me. I had always loved musical theater, but CATS opened so many doors and opportunities that I never imagined.

[44:26] Mike Abrams: That’s amazing! What was it like performing CATS in three different languages?

[44:56] Pepe Muñoz: It was challenging but also incredibly rewarding. Each language brought a different flavor to the character and the story. I had to adapt my performance style to fit the cultural nuances, which was a fascinating experience.

[45:26] Mike Abrams: I can only imagine! Do you have any memorable stories from your time performing CATS around the world?

[45:56] Pepe Muñoz: Absolutely! One of my favorite memories was performing in front of a sold-out audience in Tokyo. The energy was electric, and the audience was so engaged. It felt like we were all part of something magical that night.

[46:26] Mike Abrams: That sounds incredible! Now, shifting gears a bit, you’re currently in Moulin Rouge on Broadway. How does that compare to your experience with CATS?

[46:56] Pepe Muñoz: Both shows are spectacular in their own right, but Moulin Rouge has a different kind of energy. The music is so contemporary, and the choreography is intense. It’s a different challenge, but I love every moment of it.

[47:26] Mike Abrams: It’s great to hear how you embrace those challenges! If you had to cast the Moulin Rouge characters as CATS, who would you choose?

[47:56] Pepe Muñoz: Oh, that’s a fun question! I think Christian would definitely be a Rum Tum Tugger type, full of charisma and charm. Satine could be a Grizabella, with her longing for something more. It’s a fun exercise to think about!

[48:26] Mike Abrams: I love those choices! It’s interesting to see how the characters from both shows can relate to each other in that way.

[48:56] Pepe Muñoz: Exactly! At the end of the day, both shows are about love, longing, and the pursuit of dreams, which is what makes them so relatable.

[49:26] Mike Abrams: Well said! Before we wrap up, is there anything else you’d like to share with our listeners about your journey or your current role?

[49:56] Pepe Muñoz: Just that I’m incredibly grateful for the opportunities I’ve had and the people I’ve met along the way. CATS will always hold a special place in my heart, and I’m excited to continue sharing my passion for musical theater with audiences.

[50:26] Mike Abrams: Thank you so much, Pepe! It’s been a pleasure having you on the show.

[50:56] Pepe Muñoz: Thank you, Mike! I appreciate it.

[51:08] Mike Abrams: And to our listeners, be sure to check out Pepe on Instagram and follow his journey in Moulin Rouge. Until next time, keep celebrating the magic of theater!